cc: Eric W Wolff , plemke@awi-bremerhaven.de, ewwo@bas.ac.uk, p.j.valdes@bristol.ac.uk, r.r.dickson@cefas.co.uk, marotzke@dkrz.de, haugan@gfi.uib.no, studhope@glg.ed.ac.uk, rwood@meto.gov.uk, sfbtett@meto.gov.uk, j.m.slingo@reading.ac.uk, Lowe J , pc@soc.soton.ac.uk, a.j.watson@uea.ac.uk, Alex.Haxeltine@uea.ac.uk, k.briffa@uea.ac.uk, m.hulme@uea.ac.uk, lkeigwin@whoi.edu, cg1@mercury.soc.soton.ac.uk, apar@nerc.ac.uk, ppn@nerc.ac.uk date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 11:38:50 -0000 from: Lowe J subject: RE: modelling intercomparison (continued) to: "'I.N.McCave'" , mas@soc.soton.ac.uk I am in agreement with Nick and Eric. I understand the unease when procedures depart from the norm, but sometimes pragmatism has to prevail. In this instance, if sticking to 'the rules' means that there would be a danger of this component of the programme falling apart at the seams, then that would be to the detriment of the programme. Eric's assessment of the situation I found persuasive. John -----Original Message----- From: I.N.McCave [mailto:mccave@esc.cam.ac.uk] Sent: 18 March 2004 11:34 To: mas@soc.soton.ac.uk Cc: Eric W Wolff; plemke@awi-bremerhaven.de; ewwo@bas.ac.uk; p.j.valdes@bristol.ac.uk; r.r.dickson@cefas.co.uk; marotzke@dkrz.de; haugan@gfi.uib.no; studhope@glg.ed.ac.uk; rwood@meto.gov.uk; sfbtett@meto.gov.uk; j.m.slingo@reading.ac.uk; j.lowe@rhul.ac.uk; pc@soc.soton.ac.uk; a.j.watson@uea.ac.uk; Alex.Haxeltine@uea.ac.uk; k.briffa@uea.ac.uk; m.hulme@uea.ac.uk; lkeigwin@whoi.edu; cg1@mercury.soc.soton.ac.uk; apar@nerc.ac.uk; ppn@nerc.ac.uk Subject: Re: modelling intercomparison (continued) Dear Meric, My opinion is the same as Eric's. We should move pragmatically, and do it now. I forsee more complications and delay in other possibly more bureaucratically "fair" but less effective routes. Yours, Nick At 08:42 18/03/2004, Eric W Wolff wrote: >Meric et al., > >Of course I completely understand Peter's concern. But you know that the >motivation of the modelling subgroup was that we need to get this exercise >started as soon as possible (while 1st round projects are still >active!). We have already lost almost a year because our first attempt >was unsuccessful. If there had been a lot of groups out there wanting to >do this, my guess is that they would have found a person associated with >them to apply last time, although I realise what Peter suggested is a >very different mechanism. However, we have no guarantee that a second >attempt, by a slightly different route, will be any more successful. > >My attitude, wanting to get this rolling, was that, if NERC felt this >(Gregory) route was acceptable within their rules, then it was a good >solution. I know this prejudges, but we are unlikely to get a better >offer, in terms of expertise, connectivity to the international >intercomparisons, and willingness. It still demands that the methodology >be peer reviewed so does not compromise quality. It is not based on >random favouritism, because it builds on a submitted outline that showed a >willingness to do this kind of task. It seems to me that this method shows >the steering committee doing what it should, steering! > >Peter feels we could do a tender in a similar time. I am not so sure, but >maybe. If we do that, we have to remove Jonathans's existing outline from >the second AO or we will have duplication. I am not so sure this is fair >either. > >Anyway, in summary, I'd like to hear the NERC view on the legality of the >route we proposed. I accept that, if its considered an inappropriate >route, we have to go with a tender, but I have a feeling we would be >losing time to bureaucracy for no result if we do that. > >I have stated a rather clear opinion to try to help Meric resolve the >issue so i will sit back and wait for the brickbats. > >Eric > > >---------------------------- >Eric Wolff >British Antarctic Survey >High Cross >Madingley Road >Cambridge CB3 0ET >United Kingdom > >E-mail: ewwo@bas.ac.uk >Phone: +44 1223 221491 >Fax: +44 1223 221279 >Alternate fax: +44 1223 362616 > > >>> Meric Srokosz 16/03/04 16:31:26 >>> >Dear all - Peter Challenor has raised some issues regarding the >modelling intercomparison (see below). Do others have views? >We need to move forward on this, so I am going to set a deadline >of noon next Monday 22nd March for imput. So if you have a view >(of any kind) please e-mail the Steering Committee before the >deadline. > >Many thanks, Meric > > >I am not exactly sure what is being proposed here. Is the plan to > >remove Jonathan Gregory's proposal from the second AO and rebadge an > >expanded version as the modelling intercomparison activity or is the > >expanded version still going to be part of the AO? I am not > >particularly keen on either. In both cases we seem to be giving a > >proposal an 'inside track' to funding in way that does not to me to > >be either open or fair. There may be other groups who would have bid > >for this work if they had not thought that there was an existing > >model intercomparison activity. I should make it plain that I have > >no problem with Jonathan actually doing the work - he would be an > >excellent choice; it is the mechanism I am not happy with. > > > >I would prefer us to put out a tender for the work (after all we > >know what we want done). This would then be completely open and fair > >and I would have thought we could sort it out in a similar time > >scale to the AO. > > > >Peter >-- > > >Dr. Meric Srokosz, Room 254/43,Southampton Oceanography Centre (SOC) >Empress Dock, Southampton, SO14 3ZH, UK >Tel:+44-(0)23-80596414 (direct line); Fax: +44-(0)23-80596400 >e-mail: mas@soc.soton.ac.uk or M.Srokosz@soc.soton.ac.uk >http://www.soc.soton.ac.uk/JRD/SAT/pers/mas.html > >Science Coordinator NERC Rapid Climate Change Programme >http://rapid.nerc.ac.uk/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Prof I.N.McCave Department of Earth Sciences, University of Cambridge, Downing St. Cambridge, CB2 3EQ.UK. Phone: +44 1223 33 3422 Fax: +44 1223 33 3450 internet: mccave@esc.cam.ac.uk ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---